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meshuggah - thrash metal! what the hell??

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idiotPrayer View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote idiotPrayer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: meshuggah - thrash metal! what the hell??
    Posted: 03 Apr 2010 at 8:30am
maybe prog metal, avant garde- or sludge/post metal would be more appropriate from them.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote m@x Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Apr 2010 at 9:35am
Sounds right , Prog Metal team will manage this  !
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote CCVP Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Apr 2010 at 4:06pm
Not actually. The band's music is firmly rooted in the most innovative and brutal thrash metal. They are one of those bands that really push the boundaries of the genre. At most you can call them progressive thrash/groove, but that's it.
 
I'm sorry, but I will make my stand here: they stay in thrash.


Edited by CCVP - 03 Apr 2010 at 4:07pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Vehemency Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Apr 2010 at 4:08pm
Luckily we can keep the earliest albums on thrash and move the later albums to something else.

Edit: ^ Just the way I would vote for. Can't hear that much thrash on the latest full-lengths... Well I'm definitely not an expert in that area. :-)


Edited by Vehemency - 03 Apr 2010 at 4:12pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote micky Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Apr 2010 at 4:13pm
Originally posted by Vehemency Vehemency wrote:

Luckily we can keep the earliest albums on thrash and move the later albums to something else.


oh yes....  M@X?   others?

Is what I thought I read correct.... is this site going to be 'album based'.  ie ...groups are not listed by genres but sorted  in genres by albums. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote CCVP Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Apr 2010 at 4:13pm
Originally posted by Vehemency Vehemency wrote:

Luckily we can keep the earliest albums on thrash and move the later albums to something else.
 
Their most progressive albums are Chaosphere and Nothing, and even so it is because of their innovations. From those they both slowed down the tempo (started grooving) and became less progressive. It is like putting Slayer on progressive metal because of Raining blood and South of Heaven. Smile
 
Just not happening man. Not happening.
 
Originally posted by Vehemency Vehemency wrote:

Edit: ^ Just the way I would vote for. Can't hear that much thrash on the latest full-lengths... Well I'm definitely not an expert in that area. :-)
 
It is because they slowed down the tempo. They are half-way of doing groove metal. Wink And even if they ocasionally do record a groove metal album, groove is a thrash baby, so it won't change much.Smile


Edited by CCVP - 03 Apr 2010 at 4:16pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote m@x Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Apr 2010 at 4:16pm
Originally posted by micky micky wrote:

 oh yes....  M@X?   others?
Is what I thought I read correct.... is this site going to be 'album based'.  ie ...groups are not listed by genres but sorted  in genres by albums. 

YES ! And artists with most albums in a particular genre will appears in the genre page.

Cool hey ?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote micky Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Apr 2010 at 4:16pm
Originally posted by m@x m@x wrote:

Originally posted by micky micky wrote:

 oh yes....  M@X?   others?
Is what I thought I read correct.... is this site going to be 'album based'.  ie ...groups are not listed by genres but sorted  in genres by albums. 

YES ! And artists with most albums in a particular genre will appears in the genre page.

Cool hey ?


not simply cool.....  it ROCKS!!!! Rawkshahah
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote CCVP Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Apr 2010 at 4:18pm
Originally posted by m@x m@x wrote:

Originally posted by micky micky wrote:

 oh yes....  M@X?   others?
Is what I thought I read correct.... is this site going to be 'album based'.  ie ...groups are not listed by genres but sorted  in genres by albums. 

YES ! And artists with most albums in a particular genre will appears in the genre page.

Cool hey ?
Sort of. By this system, Genesis would be a pop band. LOL
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote micky Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Apr 2010 at 4:21pm
Originally posted by CCVP CCVP wrote:

Originally posted by m@x m@x wrote:

Originally posted by micky micky wrote:

 oh yes....  M@X?   others?
Is what I thought I read correct.... is this site going to be 'album based'.  ie ...groups are not listed by genres but sorted  in genres by albums. 

YES ! And artists with most albums in a particular genre will appears in the genre page.

Cool hey ?
Sort of. By this system, Genesis would be a pop band. LOL


LOL as they should be...as they are LOL
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Raff Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Apr 2010 at 4:22pm
Not really, Caio... They released at least eight fully prog studio albums (not counting their debut nor the controversial Duke), and only five (or six) pop ones, with some prog thrown in for good measure. Therefore, they would stay in a fully prog genre. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Vehemency Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Apr 2010 at 4:23pm
Personally I'm still a bit uncertain that a casual listener will find the material from Chaosphere onwards really thrash metal... But I will leave this for the experts. Tongue
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote UMUR Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Apr 2010 at 4:33pm
I�m in total agreement with Caio ( CCVP) here. They may not sound anything like Slayer, Testament or Forbidden but their music is deeply rooted in Thrash metal. Progressive metal on MMA should be reserved for Dream Theater and the clonesWink. I don�t really see any other genre than Thrash Metal ( and I mean all their albums) that would fit. A modern hybrid of Thrash metal but still Thrash metal when placing them in the current subs.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote idiotPrayer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Apr 2010 at 4:34pm
only meshuggahs debut may be called fully thrash metal. they were originally influenced by thrash, and then created something unique. and to say that they just slowed down the tempo is wrong. what they really did is that they became more innovative and unique = what prog metal is all about. it's a common misbelief that prog metal should be all about "look-what-i-can-do" and technicality, eg symphony x or dream theater.

catch 33 consists of ONE 45 min long song (13 tracks). not a single one off the riffs here are typical thrash metal riffs. still, there is place for complex arrangements, mechanically advancing, oddball tempos, ambient sounds and quieter dynamics, noise, electronics, programming and "robotic voices", tribal percussion and whispered vocals. 'nuff said
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote UMUR Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Apr 2010 at 4:42pm
Originally posted by Raff Raff wrote:

Not really, Caio... They released at least eight fully prog studio albums (not counting their debut nor the controversial Duke), and only five (or six) pop ones, with some prog thrown in for good measure. Therefore, they would stay in a fully prog genre. 
 
Yes Raff but think what would have happened if they had continued to produce pop albumsConfused. The balance would have shiftedBig smile. The system isn�t waterproof but what system is?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Raff Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Apr 2010 at 5:12pm
No one, indeedWink!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote The T 666 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Apr 2010 at 5:24pm
Messhugah in prog-metal would be almost an aberration. They are so different from the core bands of the genre (DT, FW) that it would be quite bizarre to put them in the same genre. Remember, on this site we HAVE the variety of metal options to put bands where they belong... As I have said, Metal itself has 23821031 genres (check metal-archives or metal-observer for a clue)  but we can work with what we have here. 

I think Thrash and industrial/groove is a good idea....they have elements of all of that.... In reality, is a new sound, based on polyrhythms and percussion-like riffs.... They're not proper thrash, but they're more thrash than prog-metal at least... 

They're a genre of their own. I'd put them in industrial metal if only for the machine-like sound they have... 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote CCVP Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Apr 2010 at 5:25pm
Originally posted by idiotPrayer idiotPrayer wrote:

only meshuggahs debut may be called fully thrash metal. they were originally influenced by thrash, and then created something unique. and to say that they just slowed down the tempo is wrong. what they really did is that they became more innovative and unique = what prog metal is all about. it's a common misbelief that prog metal should be all about "look-what-i-can-do" and technicality, eg symphony x or dream theater.

catch 33 consists of ONE 45 min long song (13 tracks). not a single one off the riffs here are typical thrash metal riffs. still, there is place for complex arrangements, mechanically advancing, oddball tempos, ambient sounds and quieter dynamics, noise, electronics, programming and "robotic voices", tribal percussion and whispered vocals. 'nuff said
 
Dude, listen, I know what you mean. I really do. But the thing is, thrash metal continued past the 80's. This band brings the thrash metal sound to the present instead of keeping it on the 80's, like the majority of thrash metal band do.
 
Are they progressive? Yes, but Slayer, Morbid Angel and Kreator also were and they are nowhere near progressive metal. Meshuggah may generate discussions like this because they are a truelly progressive metal band, but the thing is, they are more representative to thrash metal than they are to progressive metal.Smile
 
Besides, the progressive metal genres in PA are sort of a dumping ground for every aspect of progressive heavy metal, so don't use it as a measuring stick here. Wink
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote CCVP Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Apr 2010 at 5:26pm
Originally posted by Raff Raff wrote:

Not really, Caio... They released at least eight fully prog studio albums (not counting their debut nor the controversial Duke), and only five (or six) pop ones, with some prog thrown in for good measure. Therefore, they would stay in a fully prog genre. 
 
Should we count the singles, "best of"s and related then?  LOL


Edited by CCVP - 03 Apr 2010 at 5:27pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote topofsm Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Apr 2010 at 6:21pm
Plus you have to realize that for most cases the site's decided to put all the extreme progressive metal bands in the subgenre most associated with them other than progressive metal. Meshuggah's definitely progressive thrash, so for this site it's the obvious fit.

Now Fredrik Thordendal's Special Defects, on the other hand, I believe a perfect fit for avant-garde, yet it's still in thrash.
Lost respect for these archives when I saw Creed added, among other bands. Not going to be foruming here anymore. You can keep my reviews if you want.
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