| Author |
 Topic Search  Topic Options
|
Bosh66 
Forum Admin Group
Sludge, MC, HC, Post-Metal & Noise Rock
Joined: 14 Feb 2013
Location: Bolton, Lancs
Status: Offline
Points: 25301
|
 Topic: A Statement on Recent Events
Posted: 07 Jul 2021 at 12:14am |
MMA has recently been called out by a
member for transphobic comments made on this site. MMA is a site that
welcomes all metal fans irrespective of sex or gender identity, sexual
orientation, nationality or ethnicity and we take this allegation very
seriously. Steps have been taken to address the issue and an apology
issued to the member concerned. We fell short of the standard we expect
of others in this case, but we promise to do better.
We
want to make it clear that MMA welcomes open debate and supports free
speech, including on topics that may divide opinion or be considered
controversial, but those freedoms should not be expressed at the expense
of others. If members are made to feel like their identity is being
invalidated or otherwise feel uncomfortable, it may constitute hate
speech regardless of the intention behind the comments. MMA has no
choice but to remove such comments, while the poster could face
sanctions, up to and including being banned from the site. Thank you for
your understanding.
|
 |
Time Signature
MMA Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: 04 Apr 2010
Location: Denmark
Status: Offline
Points: 7690
|
Posted: 17 Jul 2021 at 4:06am |
|
Just out of curiosity, where was MMA called out and where was the transphobic statement made?
|
|
|
|
Vim Fuego
Forum Admin Group
Death, T/S/G, Grind, VA Teams
Joined: 05 Jul 2015
Location: Canterbury, NZ
Status: Online
Points: 6587
|
Posted: 17 Jul 2021 at 4:33am |
|
It was in the comments section of a review, and a line in the review was seen to be transphobic by someone who is transgender.
|
|
Time Signature
MMA Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: 04 Apr 2010
Location: Denmark
Status: Offline
Points: 7690
|
Posted: 17 Jul 2021 at 4:47am |
Ah, I see. Has the review been deleted?
[Edit: I seem to have found it]
Edited by Time Signature - 17 Jul 2021 at 5:22am
|
|
|
|
Time Signature
MMA Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: 04 Apr 2010
Location: Denmark
Status: Offline
Points: 7690
|
Posted: 17 Jul 2021 at 5:10am |
Just came across this review: https://www.trustpilot.com/review/www.metalmusicarchives.com
Could that be related to the incident?
[Edit: Having looked at the discussion, I think it is]
Edited by Time Signature - 17 Jul 2021 at 5:22am
|
|
|
|
adg211288
Forum Admin Group
Black Metal, Prog/AG Teams
Joined: 05 Nov 2010
Location: United Kingdom
Status: Offline
Points: 22166
|
Posted: 17 Jul 2021 at 5:23am |
|
That's definitely from the same person. It's sad that they felt the need to write that, since that's clearly about the original issue which was resolved and not the subsequent escalation. But that may be why they didn't take it down again. This review is unfortunate but I don't believe it will be too damaging as I can't believe that too many people will look us up on trustpilot.
|
|
|
|
Time Signature
MMA Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: 04 Apr 2010
Location: Denmark
Status: Offline
Points: 7690
|
Posted: 17 Jul 2021 at 5:33am |
|
I did manage to find it though. But, of course, I did do a very specific google search.
|
|
|
|
adg211288
Forum Admin Group
Black Metal, Prog/AG Teams
Joined: 05 Nov 2010
Location: United Kingdom
Status: Offline
Points: 22166
|
Posted: 17 Jul 2021 at 5:38am |
|
I would respond to it if I could, but only Max as the site owner can do that.
|
|
|
|
Time Signature
MMA Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: 04 Apr 2010
Location: Denmark
Status: Offline
Points: 7690
|
Posted: 17 Jul 2021 at 5:47am |
|
I wouldn't even know how to respond to it.
|
|
|
|
adg211288
Forum Admin Group
Black Metal, Prog/AG Teams
Joined: 05 Nov 2010
Location: United Kingdom
Status: Offline
Points: 22166
|
Posted: 17 Jul 2021 at 5:54am |
|
I would pretty much just rephrase the first post in this thread.
Bottom line here is that the issue was quickly addressed and the member apologised to (which was accepted for the review part of the incident at least).
We could PM the member here, asking them to take it down, of course, but it may be better to let sleeping dogs lie.
|
|
|
|
Time Signature
MMA Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: 04 Apr 2010
Location: Denmark
Status: Offline
Points: 7690
|
Posted: 17 Jul 2021 at 5:56am |
|
Yeah, if the situation has been resolved, then I guess it's best to just let it be.
Edited by Time Signature - 17 Jul 2021 at 6:15am
|
|
|
|
Bosh66
Forum Admin Group
Sludge, MC, HC, Post-Metal & Noise Rock
Joined: 14 Feb 2013
Location: Bolton, Lancs
Status: Offline
Points: 25301
|
Posted: 17 Jul 2021 at 6:42am |
|
Disappointing though. The site is hardly a hot-bed of bigotary, thankfully. It was on reflection a careless remark made that no-one picked up on (even the author), probably because we don't share the experiences of a transgender person. I know it's only one comment but this is what we didn't want to happen.
|
|
adg211288
Forum Admin Group
Black Metal, Prog/AG Teams
Joined: 05 Nov 2010
Location: United Kingdom
Status: Offline
Points: 22166
|
Posted: 17 Jul 2021 at 6:56am |
|
If you look at the dates, the trustpilot review is slightly older than the initial challenge on the review (posted June 26th, 22 days ago from today. Their first comment is only 20 days old on the review). This was clearly written before we were given a chance to address the issue.
|
|
|
|
Bosh66
Forum Admin Group
Sludge, MC, HC, Post-Metal & Noise Rock
Joined: 14 Feb 2013
Location: Bolton, Lancs
Status: Offline
Points: 25301
|
Posted: 17 Jul 2021 at 6:59am |
|
Good spot. There's likely to be only us on this site who care about what's true an factual though, unfortunately. That said, who uses TrustPilot before browsing a metal site anyway? As you suggested, the damage should be negligible.
|
|
adg211288
Forum Admin Group
Black Metal, Prog/AG Teams
Joined: 05 Nov 2010
Location: United Kingdom
Status: Offline
Points: 22166
|
Posted: 17 Jul 2021 at 7:04am |
|
It's certainly an unusual pick to call us out on, which is to our advantage. Trustpilot is more for people providing a paid service.
Of course I wouldn't say no to other members writing us some better reviews to balance this one out.
|
|
|
|
UMUR
MMA Special Collaborator
Errors & Omissions Team / Retired Admin
Joined: 25 Mar 2010
Location: Denmark
Status: Offline
Points: 18201
|
Posted: 17 Jul 2021 at 7:34am |
Personally I think it´s hopeless what people are offended by these days, and I think writing a negative review on trustpilot because of this is an overreaction of large proportion. But I guess people have different degrees and understanding of tolerance. Now that may be perceived as crude and intolerant by some, but tolerance goes both ways in my world. I accept that people are different from the norm, and I would never bother them or write anything bad about them, but on the other hand I´m not gonna make any changes to the way that I live to not insult someone else.
I´m for example still opposed to Danish kindergardens not serving pig anymore, because a minority of the children are muslims...just as an example (it´s not a rant against muslims, but an example of something I find offensive as part of a majority group). If that minority wants something else, they can bring their own food, and let the 95% of the other children in the kindergarden eat our extremely delicious Danish bacon and pig meatballs. There is a thing as going too far in not wanting to insult minorities and to cater for their every special need...just saying.
|
|
|
|
adg211288
Forum Admin Group
Black Metal, Prog/AG Teams
Joined: 05 Nov 2010
Location: United Kingdom
Status: Offline
Points: 22166
|
Posted: 17 Jul 2021 at 11:26am |
 UMUR wrote:
Personally I think it´s hopeless what people are offended by these days, and I think writing a negative review on trustpilot because of this is an overreaction of large proportion. But I guess people have different degrees and understanding of tolerance. Now that may be perceived as crude and intolerant by some, but tolerance goes both ways in my world. I accept that people are different from the norm, and I would never bother them or write anything bad about them, but on the other hand I´m not gonna make any changes to the way that I live to not insult someone else. |
In this case there was a genuine issue that needed addressing, but I agree with the sentiment here 100%. You don't end intolerance by being intolerant. It's definitely a gripe of mine that it seems to be socially acceptable to offend the majority.
|
|
|
|
Time Signature
MMA Special Collaborator
Honorary Collaborator
Joined: 04 Apr 2010
Location: Denmark
Status: Offline
Points: 7690
|
Posted: 17 Jul 2021 at 12:32pm |
|
Having read the review and the exchange, I don't think the line construed as transphobic was intended as such, but I immediatedly spotted the line in question (I read the review before the exchange). Gender identity is such a thorny issue, and it seems that one of the problems is who even has the right to have opinions on the matter. The reviewer made some legit points, I think, about gender identity seen from one perspective, but those points inadvertently offended someone with a completely different perspective and life experience. Now, I have absolutely no idea what it's like to be the victim of transphobia, but I think there might be a difference between writing a line like the one in the review and being an outright asshole who insists on using misgendering probouns and deadnames and shit like that. But, of course, I don't know what it's like.
|
|
|
|
Peacock Feather
Forum Groupie
Joined: 14 Mar 2021
Location: Russia
Status: Offline
Points: 66
|
Posted: 17 Jul 2021 at 1:37pm |
|
Leftists as usual. Sometimes I think some people must be forbidden from Internet connection cause they will always make a mountain out of a molehill. Plus there were no proofs on that Trustpilot review.
|
|
Psydye
Forum Senior Member
Joined: 22 Jan 2013
Location: PA, USA
Status: Offline
Points: 12505
|
Posted: 17 Jul 2021 at 1:58pm |
|
I haven't read the review, can anyone link me to it?
|
|
Tweet
A Statement on Recent Events