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Reviewing non-metal releases is not allowed !

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topofsm View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote topofsm Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Jun 2010 at 2:23am
Ok I just came from the Cynic Re-Traced review where it seems that people want to keep it open to review and rate based on it's metal relatedness. As far as I'm concerned that's just fine and dandy. People also want to keep Opeth's Damnation around for the same reason (I know many consider it a metal album anyways, and I'm not here to argue about that).

However, I've noticed that Pain of Salvation's latest album is in the non metal category. I haven't personally listened to that album, but I trust the site's judgment anyways, and I've sampled it anyways and the bits I've heard only support that decision.

My biggest issue is I'm not sure we have established guidelines on what to keep and what to put in non-metal for the time being. Damnation is an important album in Opeth's discography, and the duality between it and Deliverance wouldn't exist, so it does make sense that we should keep it for it's relation in Opeth's releases. But Road Salt 1 could become an important part of POS' discography as well and could be crucial to understanding the direction they take in the future (metal or not, not even the band itself probably knows at this point). Furthermore, what if Road Salt 2 is a metal release, then you have the same thing going on with Deliverance and Damnation. And then you have Cynics Re-Traced which is an EP and probably will not be an important part of Cyinic's discography, yet we're keeping it? Even with one song on the EP that isn't even quite metal itself?

These are just a few examples. I know this policy is mainly to eliminate albums by bands like Bon Jovi that are questionably metal in the first place. But there may be other examples on the site I haven't found. My main question is if we have good guidelines? Cause these three confuse me for this reason:

Damnation - non metal (arguable, though questionably metal to say the least) but important. Reviewable

Road Salt 1 - non metal, but important in a discography. Non reviewable

Re Traced - questionably metal, not important in a discography. Reviewable



Edited by topofsm - 08 Jun 2010 at 2:23am
Lost respect for these archives when I saw Creed added, among other bands. Not going to be foruming here anymore. You can keep my reviews if you want.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote J-Man Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Jun 2010 at 2:41pm
Here's my two cents... I've been thinking about this a lot lately with the dawn of the new Pain of Salvation album, and I think we should bring back the option of reviewing non metal albums with a few new restrictions. First of all here is my proposition:

  1. Reviewing & rating non-metal releases is allowed.
  2. These reviews will NOT appear on the front page.
  3. These reviews will NOT appear on the artist page either
  4. Whatever the admins decide should be done to keep these non-metal reviews from cluttering up the site.
Those points are arguable, but one point is really what gave me a strong opinion about this. Let's use Pain of Salvation as an example... even though their new album is not metal, dedicated fans of the band (mostly metalheads) will still want to hear opinions and descriptions of the album through reviews. If that isn't allowed on MMA, this will just force people to read reviews from our competition sites, which isn't a good thing at this early stage of development.

Would it really do that much damage to the site if there are some non-metal reviews from metal bands? Just look at metal-archives.com! They allow reviews for ALL albums in a band's discography, and they are the main reference source for most metalheads. The main purpose of MMA is to focus on reviews, and not allowing reviews for signicant albums in band's discographies will just detract from the overall value of our website.

Feel free to discuss this. Smile
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote m@x Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Jun 2010 at 3:18pm
Well defended J-MAN.

After reading your posts guys, I think we can find a solution here, interesting.

Let's allow non-metal releases but..
  • Only list them in the album pages
  • Do not use the rate value for any calculation in the site

Sounds good !! ??

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote J-Man Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Jun 2010 at 3:38pm
^ That sounds fantastic [email protected]Clap Thanks! Smile
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote UMUR Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Jun 2010 at 4:04pm
Originally posted by m@x [email protected] wrote:

Well defended J-MAN.

After reading your posts guys, I think we can find a solution here, interesting.

Let's allow non-metal releases but..
  • Only list them in the album pages
  • Do not use the rate value for any calculation in the site

Sounds good !! ??

Thumbs Up
 
So posting reviews of non-metal releases is now OK, but they will only appear on the album page and not on the frontpage?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Vehemency Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08 Jun 2010 at 4:32pm
Sounds good to me. There wouldn't be any toplists for non-metal albums anyways so it's not a big loss if non-metal albums don't have any rate value calculation. I'm really happy if we allow non-metal reviewing / ratings. As long as people just don't go on a frenzy and start reviewing and rating only non-metal albums.

Edited by Vehemency - 08 Jun 2010 at 4:33pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote topofsm Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Jun 2010 at 1:49am
Glad something I brought up actually helped the site instead of causing trouble. Big smile

Good job [email protected]!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Raff Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Jun 2010 at 6:10am
Originally posted by Vehemency Vehemency wrote:

Sounds good to me. There wouldn't be any toplists for non-metal albums anyways so it's not a big loss if non-metal albums don't have any rate value calculation. I'm really happy if we allow non-metal reviewing / ratings. As long as people just don't go on a frenzy and start reviewing and rating only non-metal albums.


Even on PA people NEVER rated or reviewed only non-prog albums, in spite of the loud cries of the more narrow-minded members of the community. It seems that a hundred badly written prog reviews are more valuable than a couple of well-written, well-thought-out reviews of so-called 'non-prog' albums. Personally, I have never been offended by any non-prog reviews, and I doubt I will ever be - so, I can't help wishing people tried to deal with such issues as adults.

Anyway, situation solved for the best! Thanks to [email protected] and everyone else!Smile
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote m@x Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Jun 2010 at 6:14am
Originally posted by topofsm topofsm wrote:

Glad something I brought up actually helped the site instead of causing trouble. Big smile

Indeed, thanks dude ! Thumbs Up
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote m@x Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Jun 2010 at 8:13am
GUYS,

after reviewing what needs to be done technically to implement this, we need to let you know
that we will handle this, but later. I am going to ask you to be patient. 

Thanks , I am sure you understand

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Sean Trane Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Jun 2010 at 10:58am
Originally posted by m@x [email protected] wrote:

GUYS,

after reviewing what needs to be done technically to implement this, we need to let you know
that we will handle this, but later. I am going to ask you to be patient. 

Thanks , I am sure you understand

Geek
 
Rats!! LOL
 
This means we are now allowed to review non-metal albums but only from a metal POV; right???PigPinchLOLLOL
my music collection increased tenfolds when I switched from drug-addicted musicians to crazy ones....



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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote J-Man Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Jun 2010 at 2:37pm
Originally posted by Raff Raff wrote:

Originally posted by Vehemency Vehemency wrote:

Sounds good to me. There wouldn't be any toplists for non-metal albums anyways so it's not a big loss if non-metal albums don't have any rate value calculation. I'm really happy if we allow non-metal reviewing / ratings. As long as people just don't go on a frenzy and start reviewing and rating only non-metal albums.


Even on PA people NEVER rated or reviewed only non-prog albums, in spite of the loud cries of the more narrow-minded members of the community. It seems that a hundred badly written prog reviews are more valuable than a couple of well-written, well-thought-out reviews of so-called 'non-prog' albums. Personally, I have never been offended by any non-prog reviews, and I doubt I will ever be - so, I can't help wishing people tried to deal with such issues as adults.



Pinch What if you happen to be 14? LOL
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Raff Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Jun 2010 at 3:54pm
In my experience, there are 14-year-olds that are more 'adult'  than adults. And I'll stop at thatWink...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote UMUR Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Jun 2010 at 1:49am
^I�m still 14 in my mind, but my body refuses to stop agingBig smile. Damn traitor.Angry
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote topofsm Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Jun 2010 at 2:01am
I've always been a college student on the inside. Which explains why I waste my time on sites like these LOL
Lost respect for these archives when I saw Creed added, among other bands. Not going to be foruming here anymore. You can keep my reviews if you want.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote progshine Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Jun 2010 at 1:00am
Don't like it! I just tried to vote in two Aerosmith albuns and noticed that almost all of their albuns are available but the newest ones not! And in my humble opinion the band goes pop a little bit but, not so much different from Get a Grip or Pump and hey, we can still vote/review this ones!

Edited by progshine - 12 Jun 2010 at 1:03am
Testing 1...2...3..
RAY, IT'S NOT WORKING!

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote topofsm Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Jun 2010 at 4:00am
^That's better than what I would do, I wouldn't let them on at all.

I wonder why we allowed them on when there was a statement that there weren't going to be any controversial hard rock additions...
Lost respect for these archives when I saw Creed added, among other bands. Not going to be foruming here anymore. You can keep my reviews if you want.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote m@x Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Jun 2010 at 5:54am
^^They need to be re-tag to non-metal , and then, we decided that, we will accept rating+review but only available on the album page (not the front page, not the artist page) and those rating won't be use to calculate any average rating anywhere.

Approve
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote UMUR Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 Aug 2010 at 4:47pm
^I just tried to post a review of this one: http://www.metalmusicarchives.com/rush--retrospective-3(compilation).aspx and still get this message:

"Review a non-metal album is not allowed."

From what you wrote above [email protected] I was under the impression that reviews of non-metal albums should be possible, even though they won�t appear on the frontpage. Is this in your implementation backlog?
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